(no subject)

[jay]

I'm staying home today, supposedly to recover from jet lag and to reconnect with patgreene and the kids. But the kids are in school, Pat's gone this morning (doctor) and part of this afternoon (church stuff), and I have no idea what to do today. Sitting around the house... sort of wish I were elsewhere... forced inactivity isn't my idea of R&R. Maybe these transitions would work better if I set up a busy schedule immediately upon return, rather than downtime. Maybe I should go in to work, anyway...

Comments

[tenacious-snail.livejournal.com]

I hope that the doctor is for good news and helpfulness.

A busy schedule does sound like it would be good for you, but it probably needs to be "busy that includes Pat and makes her feel appreciated, lots of time to reconnect with your kids and to release Pat from extended single parent duty". So maybe lots of lunch engagements? Book things like a massage?

[brian1789.livejournal.com]

Eh. Massage is physical contact, and that presupposes I'm going to allow myself to have that. One could become addicted to massages, which would be an expensive habit. Plus, there's the embarrassment of some masseuse having to touch my body, inflicting that on them for money...

Finding a way to spell Pat is necessary, though... or at least reinforcing her, so she doesn't feel as isolated herself.

[trinker.livejournal.com]

inflicting that on them

Er? You're going to a massage therapist in order to take care of your body, relieve physical stress (which then helps your internal state) -- what's with your reaction here? Redeveloping hatred for the external?

[brian1789.livejournal.com]

I don't see myself as at all attractive or tolerable externally, so touching me would therefore be an unpleasant chore for someone? Even a paid masseuse? My needs are less important.

[trinker.livejournal.com]

Erm...this strikes me as the sort of thing that your sweeties would bristle at.

I know you have trouble with this concept, but you really, truly are *not* hideous. As I see it, your major burden isn't anything external, but your current conviction that you're sub par (and the attendant splashover onto your sweeties). It's clear what it takes for you to have a sense of validation about your intellect, what would it take for you to lose the sense that you're some sort of ... what, a booby prize? I don't wish to suggest that you should grade yourself based on your partners, but this round of self-effacing self-deprivation isn't doing *anyone* any favors.

The masseuse isn't there to take pleasure in your body, she's trying to offer you a service -- and believe me, I know enough professional massage therapists to understand the range of clientele they serve. What bothers them is rudeness, pawing, lack of hygiene, and other forms of disrespect -- I know a few who say that they find it distracting and unpleasant to massage someone they find physically compelling, anyway. (Giving an intimate partner a massage is one thing, having to struggle to quell inappropriate responses is another.)

[brian1789.livejournal.com]

They presumably must have a somewhat different perception, or they wouldn't touch me themselves. OTOH, most of my existing romantic poly relationships include little (1-2 times/year) or no sexual intimacy at all, so perhaps the gap in perceptions isn't wide. And I'm certainly not flirted-with-intent or pursued among friends, even casually.

To lose that view... I suppose I'd need counter-evidence. Two of my partners like me to hold them, and I often feel more attractive and interesting when I'm with them. Socially, though, around here in CA my impression is that I'm considered an also-ran, if not a booby-prize.

Even as a paid service, there must be more-pleasant and less-pleasant clients to touch, massage-wise...

[trinker.livejournal.com]

Brian, if by "around here in CA" you're talking about the hot tub crowd -- it seems to me that you've mentioned that you feel excluded in all sorts of ways there, but I also recall others form that group mentioning that it's a matter of your not feeling comfortable asserting yourself there, and it's very much a "must demonstrate consent and willingness by initiating action" environment. If you're using the metric "people in that community don't seek me out to interact with", you're measuring with a badly calibrated tool.

What is it that you imagine would make you an unpleasant client?

[brian1789.livejournal.com]

Badly calibrated, perhaps, but it is all that I have as feedback. So losing that view of myself sounds unlikely, not something I'm likely to find local support for here. Assuming it is incorrect.

I expect I'd be a visually-unappealing client to touch...

[trinker.livejournal.com]

If I'm understanding this correctly, you feel everything requires external validation. Still, is it useful to use the wrong instrument to take readings?

I don't understand what you mean by "visually-unappealing client to touch". Is it a case of "they wouldn't feel sexually drawn to me, feel compelled to touch me, without the intercession of money, so it feels dirty to pay for a massage" ? I think you're conflating intimate exchange of massages in a non-professional context with the professional therapeutic services being paid for. Surely you don't require that other people offering you professional services should have been willing to do it in the "doing you a personal favor" sense?

Again, read what you wrote. You're using the way that people at the hot tub parties don't approach you as proof that you're unappealing, when it seems to me that they're operating from a "if you don't approach, we will respect your boundaries" paradigm. You have conflicting base assumptions. You either need to change your assumptions or change to a venue where your assumption matches the prevalent mode.