Schrodinger's revenge

[jay]

Interesting to note how friends, partners, people-in-general shift during difficult periods... especially noteworthy when there's a sharp difference between gently chiding or supportive one-on-one discussions and a seemingly-harsher line taken by the same folks in public spaces. One senses attempts to play off both sides in a dispute... or perhaps an unwillingness to burn bridges.

Nonetheless, I've certainly noted who my friends have been -- and haven't been, at least not openly -- in this recent flap. Other folks say that they may like me, but they're unwilling to trust me unless I promise to communicate the manner they prefer? Fine, but that statement cuts two ways... my own trust-assessments have certainly been adjusted downward recently for some people, upward for others. The chestnut about difficult times differentiating between true friends and those posing as such has some validity, unfortunately. Likewise the one about Schrodinger's cat... containers have been opened. One way or the other...

Comments

Noodle, schmoodle

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

[Note: I know this is your journal, and there will be no hard feelings from me if you choose to delete this comment. I am not posting any flames, nor do I have any desire to fight with you about recent events. I'm just musing on my own motives behind the things I've said to you, in private and public, about this issue:]

When I say "It's hard for me to trust you if I know that you are consciously presenting a facade during some of our interactions," I don't see that as an attempt to coerce you into behaving how I prefer. I just see it as straightforward feedback about how your behavior affects my feelings about you.

Lately, I have the impression that people's negative reactions to your explanation of how you behaved on the list (I'm nomail at the moment, so I haven't followed the thread lately, only what has ended up here), is that you might feel painted into a corner, like you are giving up something of yourself if you change anything about your interaction style as a result of this series of events. Speaking only for myself, I can empathize with feeling piled on, and digging in even further because of it. However, I sometimes find that those protective impulses (and I think they're *legitimate* and *protective* impulses, so please don't read that as saying they're bad in themselves) just simply don't get me what I want, which is to have people around me who know I can be counted on to be myself, and to fight fair. If that's one of the things you want, you might consider letting down some of your defenses and acknowledging that you have been deliberately hurting the people you might want to count as friends some time in the future. (And if you have no desire to have any of the people in your online communities as friends, I'm not clear on why you're there.)

Lastly, I saw where you said that others get away with sarcasm/irony and you don't. I think the difference is that those others, when they're misunderstood, don't crow about how they've had so much fun being someone they're not, and are now sitting back having even more fun watching people get upset about how they've been played.

Take this unsolicited commentary for what it's worth. Or not. Up to you.

[sisterfish125.livejournal.com]

Brian:
I'm sorry I wasn't there to support you in your time of great stress.
I have a load of stuff on my plate right now, and it is my opinion that a half-assed opinion isn't worth squat when compared to one with the full thought process behind it, especially when it's a heated discussion. That's why I kept out of things--I didn't want to cloud the underlying issues.

I hope things are settling down for you, and that you can find some peace.
Jen

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

I've not been involved in any of these recent discussions, but I have - in my own time - noticed that even people who love me very much can sometimes get carried away by the discussion and forget to be kind at the same time. It can be a constant process of negotiation and meta-communication. Of course, some relationships are worth this much effort...

[cjsmith.livejournal.com]

containers have been opened. One way or the other...

Often, long-term, that's a good thing. I very much like knowing who my friends are, although the process of finding out can hurt quite a bit sometimes.

[7patches.livejournal.com]

attempts to play off both sides in a dispute... or perhaps an unwillingness to burn bridges.

I don't think those are necessarily bad things, especially of one is not directly involved in the dispute, wants to understand everybody's point of view, and wants to stay friends with everybody.
Of course, friendship can only continue if there is trust, and that is a fragile thing.